1903: Arthur Alfred Lynch condemned 1795: Unspecified Robespierrists

1989: Ted Bundy, psycho killer

January 24th, 2009 Headsman

Qu’est-ce que c’est?

It was 20 years today that Ted Bundy, the signature sexual psychopath in a golden age of serial killers,* rode the lightning in Florida’s Starke Prison.

Executed Today is pleased to mark the occasion with a conversation with Louisville crime writer Kevin M. Sullivan, author of a forthcoming2009 book on Ted Bundy … and a man who knows how the world looks from inside Bundy’s ski mask.

Ted Bundy is obviously one of the most iconic, written-about serial killers in history. Why a book about Ted Bundy? What’s the untold story that you set out to uncover?

The desire, or drive, if you will, to write an article about Ted Bundy and then create a 120,000 plus word book about the murders, was born out of my crossing paths with his infamous murder kit. Had Jerry Thompson [a key detective on the Bundy case -ed.] left Bundy’s stuff in Utah that May of 2005, well, it would have been an enjoyable meeting with the former detective, but I’m certain it would have all ended quietly there. Indeed, I doubt if I’d even considered writing an article for Snitch [a now-defunct crime magazine -ed.], much less a book about the killings. But it was having all that stuff in my hands, and in my home, and then being given one of the Glad bags from Ted’s VW that made it very real (or surreal) to me, and from this, a hunger to find out more about the crimes led me forward.

Ted Bundy’s gear, right where you want it — image courtesy of Kevin M. Sullivan. (Check the 1975 police photo for confirmation.)

Believe me, in a thousand years, I never would have expected such a thing to ever come my way. I can’t think of anything more odd or surreal.

ET: You mentioned that you think you’ve been able to answer some longstanding questions about Bundy’s career. Can you give us some hints? What don’t people know about Ted Bundy that they ought to know?

I must admit, when I first decided to write a book about the crimes, I wasn’t sure what I’d find, so the first thing I had to do was read every book ever written about Bundy, which took the better portion of three or four months.

From this I took a trip to Utah to again meet with Thompson and check out the sites pertaining to Bundy and the murders in that state. Next came the acquisition of case files from the various states and the tracking down of those detectives who participated in the hunt for the elusive killer.

Now, no one could have been more surprised than me to begin discovering what I was discovering about some of these murders. But as I kept hunting down the right people and the right documents, I was able to confirm these “finds” at every turn. And while I cannot reveal everything here, It’s all in the book in great detail. Indeed, you could say that my book is not a biography in the truest sense, but rather an in-depth look at Bundy and the murders from a vantage point that is quite unique. I wish I could delve further into these things now , but I must wait until it’s published.

The Bundy story has a magnetic villain and a host of victims … was there a hero? Was there a lesson?

The real heroes in this story are the detectives who worked day and night for years to bring Ted Bundy to justice. And if there’s a lesson to be learned from all of this, it is this: It doesn’t matter how handsome or articulate a person might be, or how nicely they smile at you, for behind it all, there could reside the most diabolical person you’ll ever meet! We need to remember this.

But how can you act on that lesson without living in a continual state of terror? Bundy strikes me as so far outside our normal experience, even the normal experience of criminality, that I’m inclined to wonder how much can be generalized from him.

Actually, (and I might say, thank God here!) people as “successful” as Ted Bundy don’t come our way very often. I mean, the guy was a rising star in the Republican Party in Washington, had influential friends, a law student, and certainly appeared to be going places in life. Some were even quite envious of his ascension in life. However, it was all a well-placed mask that he wore to cover his true feelings and intentions. On the outside he was perfect, but on the inside a monster. He just didn’t fit the mold we’re used to when we think of a terrible killer, does he?

Now, there are those among us — sociopaths — who can kill or do all manner of terrible things in life and maintain the nicest smile upon their faces, but again, just beneath the surface ticks the heart of a monster, or predator, or what ever you might want to call them. Having said that, I’m not a suspicious person by nature, and so I personally judge people by their outward appearance until shown otherwise. Still, it’s difficult (if not impossible) to see the “real” individual behind the person they present to us on a daily basis.

You worked with case detectives in researching your book. How did the Ted Bundy case affect the way law enforcement has subsequently investigated serial killers? If they had it to do over again, what’s the thing you think they’d have done differently?

They all agree that today, DNA would play a part of the investigation that wasn’t available then. However, in the early portion of the murders, Bundy made few if any mistakes, as he had done his homework so as to avoid detection. As such, even this wouldn’t be a panacea when it came to a very mobile killer like Bundy who understood the very real limitations sometimes surrounding homicide investigations.

I can’t help but ask about these detectives as human beings, too. Clearly they’re in a position to deal with the heart of darkness in the human soul day in and day out and still lead normal lives … is a Ted Bundy the kind of killer that haunts or scars investigators years later, or is this something most can set aside as all in a day’s work?

They are, first of all, very nice people. And you can’t be around them (either in person, or through numerous phone calls or emails) for very long before you understand how dedicated they are (or were) in their careers as police officers. They are honorable people, with a clear sense of duty, and without such people, we, as a society, would be in dire circumstances indeed.

Even before Bundy came along, these men were veteran investigators who had seen many bad things in life, so they carried a toughness which allowed them to deal with the situations they came up against in a professional manner. That said, I remember Jerry Thompson telling me how he looked at Ted one day and thought how much he reminded him of a monster, or a vampire of sorts. And my book contains a number of exchanges between the two men (including a chilling telephone call) which demonstrate why he felt this way

How about for you, as a writer — was there a frightening, creepy, traumatic moment in your research that really shook you? Was there an emotional toll for you?

Absolutely. But the degree of “shock”, if you will, depends (at least for me) on what I know as I first delve into each murder. In the Bundy cases I had a general knowledge of how Bundy killed, so there wasn’t a great deal that caught me by surprise, as it were. Even so, as a writer, you tend to get to know the victims very well through the case files, their family members or friends, and so on. Hence, I’ll continue to carry with me many of the details of their lives and deaths for the remainder of my life. And so, lasting changes are a part of what we do.

However, I did a story a few years back about a 16 year old girl who was horribly murdered here in Kentucky, and this case did cause me to wake up in the night in a cold sweat. Perhaps it was because I have a daughter that was, at the time, only a few years younger than this girl, and that some of what transpired did catch me off guard, so to speak, as I began uncovering just what had happened to this very nice kid.

Watch for Kevin M. Sullivan’s forthcoming The Bundy Murders: A Comprehensive History from McFarland in summer or fall of 2009.

* In fact, the term “serial killer” was coined in the 1970’s by FBI profiler Robert Ressler, as an improvement on the sometimes inaccurate category of “stranger killer”.

Additional Bundy resources from the enormous comment thread:

On this day..

Entry Filed under: 20th Century,Capital Punishment,Common Criminals,Crime,Death Penalty,Electrocuted,Execution,Florida,History,Infamous,Murder,Popular Culture,Serial Killers,Sex,USA

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7,878 thoughts on “1989: Ted Bundy, psycho killer”

  1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

    Hello all!

    My publisher, WildBlue Press, is offering my new book on Ted Bundy ( as well as some other books of mine) at .99 cents starting tomorrow- but these prices won’t last long!

    Beginning May 6 get TRAIL OF TED BUNDY: Digging Up The Untold Stories and KENTUCKY BLOODBATH: Ten Bizarre Tales of Murder From the Bluegrass State for just 99 cents! But hurry the 99 cent deal only lasts a couple days; after that, the price will increase incrementally until returning to full price on May 10.
    ALSO, as a special thank you from Kevin and WildBlue Press, you can order VAMPIRE: The Richard Chase Murders for FREE during this same time period.

    THE TRAIL OF TED BUNDY: Digging Up the Untold Stories is a look into the life of serial killer Ted Bundy, from those who knew him, to those who chased him, and from those who mourned his many victims. Get it here: http://wbp.bz/thetrailoftedbundy

    1. craig says:

      Hi Kevin….just finished On the Trail…. you indicate that you visited several sites pertaining to Bundy but not many photos of them made it into the book….how about another book showing photos of bundy haunts, hangouts, and crime scenes as they appeared in the ’70’s and what they look like now? Shame that Chi Omega was remodeled and that The Oaks burned down.
      I keep hoping that someone will do a semi-professional dvd showing these locations and offering it for sale.

      1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

        Hi Craig…

        The decision to have fewer photos than I had anticipated was made by the publisher. However, I will ask them if they can add all of the photos I sent them during my trip to a special page at WildBlue Press, and I’ll add the captions for each. We originally talked about that anyway. I’m sure they’ll be agreeable to the idea, so let me ask.

        Also, if you haven’t yet left a review on Amazon (or Audible if it’s an audio book), could you do so? Every good review helps. Thanks!

  2. bart says:

    Hi, Kevin and others

    Oh, lazy me.
    It only took seconds to type “Georgann Hawkins’ Mom, interview” and I googled the interview.
    But one thing stroke me most.
    The following part:
    “In 1972-73, the 17-year-old Lakes High School senior was named to the royal court of the Washington Daffodil Festival….Georgann made the newspapers regularly as the princesses traveled the state attending concerts, meeting children, riding in parades and signing autographs at charity events. A highlight was a trip to the state Legislature, where Georgann addressed lawmakers in spring 1973.”

    Is it possible that Bundy knew Georgann from local papers?
    And then he promised himself to put his dirty hands on that daffodil?
    I know it is only a speculation but not so wild.
    It is not that dogmatic that Bundy’s victims were always random and he only wanted the ones he had never met before.
    Specially, in the case of seeing Georgann in local paper by him – we cannot say he really knew her – just saw her.

    Remember that he MAY have known Lynda Ann Healy – they may have shared the same lectures.
    Remember that he MAY have known Melissa Smith from sight as she and Ted Bundy frequented the same malls and cafeterias in Salt Lake – and she was kind of loud, showing off type of person, being a police officer daughter.
    That might be extra factor to Bundy, to play game with police. This Melissa issue was raised by one poster thousands post ago. But Georgeann followed by the predator in papers sounds not so unrealistic.

    1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

      There’s no evidence that shows that, Bart. That would be pure speculation.

      1. bart says:

        Yeah, I know Bundy in his pre-execution confession covered Hawkins murder to a specially great detail, but never mentioned that he had known victim before. But he never told all the stuff – that testimony was kind of teaser coverage in his eyes – next to be told – after earning stay of execution. Nevertheless I still remember those teen mags found with Bundy when he was apprehended. Anyway from what I understand Hawkins as daffodile princess was covered in WA newspaper in 1972/73 and he attacked her a year later. I think Bundy was kind of short-term stalker – maybe months not years.

        1. Steve says:

          No way at all. What he did was generally far more random than that. Sure, he’d stalk some. But that was about the hunt and was nothing personal.

  3. Kevin M Sullivan says:

    Well, I must weigh in on the latest Bundy issue to pop up lol!

    Concerning the new book, I survived Ted Bundy, I will make some points about it: First, I have not read the book so I will withhold my full opinion until I do; and that could be some time as it isn’t a priority with me (say, could that mean something? Lol!)

    Okay: Here are the red flags I have about her book. First, any testimony that comes out of what has been referred to as “recovered memories” is always suspect to me. Another bad sign is that she did not report the assault at that time. Now, you may be thinking that other women have done that very thing, and that’s true. However, we’re talking about an area – Salt Lake City and its surroundings- and this woman would have been aware of the fast accumulating murders, and to not report the rape during this terrible time of women dying, strikes me as exceedingly strange. In my view, this is very very odd.

    I AM NOT saying this poor lady wasn’t attacked by someone, but I just don’t think it was Bundy.

    Why don’t I think it was Bundy, you ask? Well, she lived through it!!!!! After the failure to kill his first victim of 1974, he NEVER made that mistake again, starting with Lynda Ann Healy.

    So, which way do I lean in this building Bundy controversy (lol!)? I would say Ted Bundy was not involved with anything that happened to this woman.

    My opinion only.

    1. Steve says:

      I fully agree. Her escape alone sounds hard to believe.

      After it’s over she just goes home and tells nobody. I just can’t believe it.

      1. Kevin Sullivan says:

        Yes, it is difficult to believe. It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out in the future; pertaining to how accepted it is by the public, that is. It can’t be an easy thing claiming to be a Ted Bundy survivor. As far as I know, Carol DaRonch is the only one to slip through Bundy’s hands. And all of the proof is there to back up her story.

  4. Steve says:

    There is a woman named Rhonda Stapley, that went on Dr. Phil claiming that she survived Ted. I do not believe her for a second.

    She didn’t even go to the police after being raped and nearly murdered. Yea….sure.

    1. Shelley says:

      I haven’t watched it yet but we do have to wonder…why now? I found the episode online to watch later. In case someone needs this info:
      Dr. Phil
      Season 14 Episode 142
      Title: Beautiful Mother Dead and Dismembered: The Ex-Girlfriend of the Man Accused Speaks Out
      (the first half deals with the above and the second half with the Bundy victim)

      1. Steve says:

        I’m hard pressed to believe someone could be able to remember what happened after all she claimed she went through. She was beaten, raped, and strangled. Strangled over and over again. Making her pass out, then bringing her back. Then she fell and hit her face on some rocks….Yea, sounds like something you could remember.

        And why now? She has a book to sell.

        1. NW gal says:

          I agree with you all. I can’t imagine her memory is accurate.

          There are MANY stories around the PNW where women believe they got away from Bundy. Some probably did; as he confessed at the end of is life he said there were times where he just didn’t follow through. A woman would carry his books to his car and he would just say “thanks…”

          I read an article that singer Debbie Harry claims to have survived Bundy. http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/debharry.asp

          1. Steve says:

            I don’t believe Harry’s account either. But I can see why she could believe it was him. On the other hand, this woman is just trying to make money.

            The only way you survive an attack in that scenario, is if the attacker thinks you’re dead. You do not make an escape tho.

          2. Larry G says:

            Of course as soon as I saw and watched this, where else do I go to discuss? :) Interesting to hear your perspectives. I’m normally a pretty cynical person molded by life’s cruelties like everyone else. So I don’t consider myself naive. Maybe part of it is that I feel extremely sad for her assuming it’s true, being an older, normal woman that may have gone through close to the worst thing that could happen to a person. So…on this one…I tend to believe her. Choosing to take her word for it. And I feel very sad for her. Is there a chance this happened to her and it wasn’t Bundy? Sure. Do I think she’s making it all up to sell a book? I don’t. Sounds like Bundy was in the car going for his length of cord when she woke up. If he did this between 30 and 120 times, statistically it was bound to happen. We’re all entitled to our opinion. This particular cynical person believes that during those times, she would’ve felt and been shamed and stigmatized so much more for this happening to her, and I buy her wanting to forget and move on, rather than get involved once he was identified.

      2. Kevin Sullivan says:

        Thanks Shelley!

  5. bart says:

    Hi Kevin,

    I have a question, a bizarre one, what is not unsual from me lol.

    I remember such comments from Bundy that hunting of victims was equally (or even more) exciting comparing to murder or that ultimately, “summarizing” Bundy never got out of his murders what he really expected.
    My question is – can anybody reconstruct the variety of emotions that ran through Bundy’s mind during example hunting-abduction-sex-murder-aftermath event? Looks like he experienced a lot of different impulses excluding maybe feeling guilty.
    I know, Kevin, you will tell me again “Read my book” lol or “Get a crystal ball and call Bundy in hell”.
    But I am just asking. :) Maybe it is not that silly :)
    I think to be close to such answers we should thoroughly read the reports of psychologists’/psychiatric’ the ones who examined Bundy and others who later “interpreted” him. But I am too dumb to do it :)
    Take care

    1. Kevin Sullivan says:

      Hi Bart,

      I think you’re reading too much into his statement. He meant that in his fantasy world of murder, all things went the way his mind was imagining it. In that fantasy all was perfect. But in the real life of murder, not all lined up as in his fantasies.

      But make no mistake: he loved committing the murders and all that came with it. And he never wanted to give that up. And that’s why I’m saying you are reading too much into his statement.

      Take care,


      1. bart says:

        Hi, Kevin

        Thanks for answering me.
        I was much more getting at what spectrum of emotions ran through his mind than at interpreting his thoughts about murder from behind bars.
        It is obvious he loved killing but I was interested in psychological process occurring inside his mind during crime event.
        Because it is like looking inside alien’s mind, but still party human.
        I remember (from Bundy’s testimony that non necessarily reliable) that he among other felt scared at what did.
        For example – he was throwing out of his vehicle victim’s clothes in a panic (only to collect it thoroughly as the panic passed) or he woke up the next day after the murder, hoping that what happened was only a dream.
        Another emotion – anger – when he could not make it to lure any victims and went home “empty-handed”.
        This is what I meant. Spectrum of emotions from a monster.

        1. Kevin Sullivan says:


          Thought produces emotion and emotion produces action. This is how it works. And because we do not know his exact thoughts at those time, we can’t be completely certain about his emotions. But we can have a pretty good idea of what he was experiencing and why.

          1. bart says:

            Thanks, Kevin. I pose questions impossible to answer – reconstructing Bundy’s emotions – certainly varying from murder to next murder. Killing – a preposterous act to me – unless you are a soldier or using self-defense when being attacked by someone really dangerous. Then, you have a “conscious” guy like Bundy who devotes his whole lifetime to prepare, commit and hide murder after murder. It sounds like an alien but it still human!

  6. Shelley says:

    Ran across this article by someone who interviewed Mrs. Bundy and Mrs. Rancourt on the day of Ted’s execution and they spoke to each other! The link is below but in case it gets old, you can try Googling “Mrs. Bundy by Dana Middleton Silberstein”.

    (Ignore the picture at the start of the page…has nothing to do with the article that follows)

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hey Shelley…

      Yes, I remember reading that a year or so ago. Very interesting. Did you happen to read the interview last year of Georgann Hawkins’ mom? She’s living in Utah now (I believe), and it was an article published in the local paper. What’s interesting is that it was the first she’s done since the disappearance of her daughter.

      1. Sandy says:


        I read the article on Georgeanne Hawkin’s mom. It included a picture of Georgeanne I’d never seen before. It really hit me how long ago all of the murders occurred.

        1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

          So true, Sandy. Everyone connected to the case is getting rather long in the tooth. And that’s why i decided to write my second book on the case.

          I’m glad Mrs. Hawkins consented to the interview. She’s 92, maybe 93 by now.

          1. bart says:

            Any link or at least the tile of this Utah local paper?

      2. Shelley says:

        No, I had not read that article with Georgann’s mom so thanks!!

    2. Steve says:

      I’ve read that article. It’s about as depressing as you can get. I feel horrible for his mother.

      Knowing she had the news on, which was reporting about him dying. I can only imagine how uncomfortable that had to be to see that.

      1. NW gal says:

        I read this article two years ago and just re-read it. It’s heartbreaking. I can’t imagine how Mrs. Bundy suffered living through, and then living after, these experiences.

        I also can’t imagine what the other Mrs. Bundy, his wife, suffered. After all of those years supporting and believing him only to learn he was a horrible monster.

        They were victims, too.

  7. Kevin M Sullivan says:

    Hi all,

    Unnatural Causes, a trilogy of murder and mayhem, that I co-authored with Gregg Olsen, is on sale for only 99 cents for a limited time. This has very interesting murder cases from Kentucky, Ohio and Pennsylvania. Truly a great read at a great price. If I didn’t already own it I’d buy it myself lol!


    1. Meaghan says:

      Bought it. Haven’t looked at it yet but read the description. I wonder if Alec Krieder, the Pennsylvania killer, is related to the Krieder family that was killed in North Dakota. (I wrote about it here; a dreadful massacre. Search for it if you want to know the details.) The North Dakota Krieders were originally from Pennsylvania and the surviving children returned there after the murders to be raised by relatives. I think the dead were also shipped back there for burial.

      1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

        Thanks for the purchase of the book, Meaghan.

        Wow! I’ll bet they’re related in some way, if they’re from PA. Maybe distant of some sort.

        I’ll check out your story on the family.

        Thanks again!

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  9. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

    Hey Jason,’

    I couldn’t reply directly to you as things are still messed up as to order of posts. Anyway, that confession is packed away again, and I’m far too busy to dig stuff out and scan, email, etc. Indeed, I occasionally get such requests and I am always forced to say no. But having first, The Bundy Murders, and now The Trail of Ted Bundy, you have the best parts of it. :)

  10. Brad says:

    Hi all,

    Does anyone know where I can find the interview with Sgt. Bob Hayward where he relives the Utah arrest of bundy.. I recall watching it on youtube but cant retrieve it.


  11. Jason Nelson says:

    I finished reading the companion Book to the Bundy murders and thoroughly enjoyed the read, with the new tidbits of information scattered throughout the book showing the darker side to Ted Bundy’s personality.

    Firstly, what I found very interesting is the connection between Bundy and Lynda Healy. A psychology professor had both Healy and Bundy sharing classes as early as 1971! less than three years before Bundy captured her in early 1974. If you couple this with the information from Bob Keppell that both Bundy and Healy both cashed cheques at the same safeway store prior to her murder, it suggests that Bundy was keeping tabs on her for a long time, stalking her and possibly had some type of communication with her. This is probably why so little is known about her murder as Bundy had likely built some type fasination with her, fantasing about her murder and eventually planning the best way to abduct her, namely she was a victim that he knew and possibly felt a strong deep connection too.

    1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

      Thanks Jason for the good words about the book!

      Yes, the check cashing at the same Savemart (or whatever it was) was an interesting tidbit. And in the record I’ve seen both copies of Healy’s and Bundy’s cashed checks.

      1. Jason Nelson says:

        It’s highly likely that Bundy was stalking her at that particular time, finding out information about her life, friends, jobs etc. This may have assisted in him abducting her as he seemed to know which room she was in. Although Bundy did admit in Florida to not murdering people that he knew, Lynda may have been one of the few exceptions.

        Another interesting tidbit was Bundys comment to Ann Rule whilst he was on Bail in late 1975. ‘If I did do it, I wouldn’t be silly enough to do anything here’. Not exactly the words of an innocent man. His dislike to being followed by the police was more important than maintaining his innocenice. It’s these types of comments that allude to his guilt.

        1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

          Yes, Healy may have been Bundy’s target from the get-go as they say. But we’ve not found anything that absolutely connects him to her in such a way that says, yes!- he was after Healy.

          Ah, there are still things we don’t know lol!

          And yes, Bundy did have that odd thing where he couldn’t help but link himself to the crimes by blabbing such statements.

          1. Jason Nelson says:

            For me, the shocking part is that Bundy shared classes with Healy, went to the same shopping centres as her and frequented the same bars (Dantes Tavern) as her. The connection is definitely there. If we believe that she was his first official murder, he could have planned it for a very long time. He also told Hagmaier that he would stalk some victims to gain more knowledge of their life and I think she fell into that category.

            Apart from those who knew Bundy, I think it’s unlikely we will get such an indepth account of Bundy and his murders without the same rehashing of information. Thanks to you Kevin, we have been given a fresh new look into the case with new, unpublishEd information along the way. Two thumbs up from me.

            Kevin, do you still have a copy of the Idaho confession in full that can be sent via email? I remember you offered it a number of years ago after the Bundy murders was published. I just wondered as it would make for some good reading?

  12. bart says:

    Hi, Kevin

    I have bought your new Bundy book (well by mistake I bought it twice :) but gonna get the second one refunded ) and I am in the process of reading it (almost finishing it). I was a little bit disappointed that it is so short but now I understand it as a small companion volume to your main book “The Bundy Murders”. I was also hoping this book will pay some more homage to the victims – the girls, women – depicting their previous lives (no matter how short) until fate crossed their paths with homicidal maniac. I can see you devoted some more verses on Kathy Parks thanks to her high school colleague account back in California. And or course thanks to our poor Lorraine.
    Victims deserve such stories ans memories but OTOH the best think to honor them is no to link them directly to Bundy. I notice that memorials held for them never mention Bundy – so it should stay this way.
    Maybe some day someone linked with some victim families organizations will release a larger volume overall devoted to all brutal murder victims (not only Bundy’s murders) depicting their lives – so brutally terminated?
    Anyway your book works well. Thanks

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hey Bart…

      Well, maybe one day someone will come along and write a book exclusively pertaining to the victims. I suppose it could happen, but I wouldn’t hold my breath if I were you, lol!

      It’s good to hear from you. :)


      1. bart says:

        Yeah, yeah. I know what you mean. Murder is “cool”, regular lives – isolated from their tragic endings – boring. Even the lives set in the US in 70s – now very trendy era – see the must-see tv show “Vinyl :). On the internet there some FB page devoted to Bundy’s victims but they all have strange feeling to them – like Bundy still owns those victims.
        Maybe the best is to let those poor souls to rest in peace and leave the memories to their families. Too bad such people – father, mothers, cousins, friends are leaving too – from normal biological reasons. Even the last and the youngest of the killed ones – Kimberley Leach would have turned 51 this year. Yet more decades to pass and those girls would have been remembered only as “Bundy’s targets”. Sad. Unjust.

        1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

          No Bart, murder is not cool, but you do have issues. You are driven in odd ways, just as you were when you first came to this site. Back then I remember you practically wanted to take things over here and make the blog about the victims. And then I had to tell you NO, you weren’t going to change things; I had to explain how this is about the Bundy case in its entirety: Bundy, the victims, the investigators, etc.
          And now today you are once again inserting your views in the same ways, practically chiding us for not bringing the victims up to the level that you want them to be.

          You’re not fooling anybody, Bart

          1. bart says:

            Come on, Kevin, I have no issues. Neither hidden agenda to reshape this thread into the tribute to victims, without actually telling they were the victims. I appear here so rarely but it still seems like I pose a threat :) Plus assuming I have issues (or had issues) – they were various ones – as I far as I remember. Not only the victims’ thing.

          2. Kevin M Sullivan says:

            Okay, Bart, but I’ll be watching you, lol!

  13. Brad says:

    Hi Kevin,

    Do you know where Janice Ott was murdered? Ive read her remains were found at Lake Sammamish, do you have knowledge on this aspect of her disappearance? Where was the place he took his victims on this day?


    Oh and I’ve read your latest book via Kindle, great work as expected!

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Thanks for the good words about the book, Brad! :)

      The partial remains of Janice Ott, as well as Denise Naslund, were located at a dump site in Issaquah, about four miles from the lake.

      Glad you liked the book.

  14. Headsman says:

    I just set the comments to go newest-to-oldest and that seems to have cleaned up the old comments that were still hanging around on this page. (Previously, comments were oldest-to-newest in general, but still paginated after 50 … so in principle you’d be seeing the most recent 50 top-level comments, but the 50th most recent of those first. Add in threaded replies, and the whole thing is a mess.)

    The current setup seems like a more pleasing appearance as pertains this thread, which is by far the most active on this site. Do others agree? I can’t code to order but if there’s a groundswell for a different approach I shall try my best to fiddle with knobs accordingly.

    1. Larry G says:

      Thanks for your help headsman!! Looks better.

  15. Shelley says:

    Just finished the book, Kevin. Great read! I just love all the new tidbits and I appreciate you putting it in a book for posterity. I will be writing a review later for Amazon. Cheers!

    1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

      Thanks Shelley, I’m glad you enjoyed it!

      Getting things in print for posterity is a biggie for me. I want future researchers to have as much as possible when their time comes to tackle the Bundy case. :)

  16. Larry G says:

    Two reasons for this post. One, just got the Kindle version of your new book, Kevin, and can’t wait to tear into it over the next three hours or so. Second, I want to see where my comment is going to end up. I’m not sure if conversation died down, or the comments are permanently screwed up, making us finished here. I hope not.

    Thanks Kevin, can’t wait to start reading this! (In about 5 minutes).

    Larry G

    1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

      Hey Larry!

      Yes, folks are still posting, but I do think the comment stream is messed up. But keep posting and I will too!

    2. Sandy says:

      I, too, received the Kindle version yesterday. I’ve already started it! I couldn’t wait!

  17. Jason Nelson says:

    I have my copy of the new Bundy book. Look forward to getting started with it

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hey Jason!

      I thought I responded to you, but apparently not. Sorry!

      Anyway, I’m glad you have the book and I”m looking forward to hearing (or reading) your thoughts concerning it. :)

  18. Fiz says:

    The paperback is out in the UK and on its way to me, Kevin! I can’t wait! :)

    1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

      Enjoy it, Fiz! You’ll have your copy before I have mine lol!

  19. Ted Montgomery says:

    I’ve been fortunate enough to get a sneak peek at Kevin’s new book and I can assure everyone here that they will be
    enthralled as they read it. That’s all I’m saying for now.

  20. Kevin Sullivan says:

    Here’s an article from Psychology Today about my new Bundy book…


  21. Kevin Sullivan says:

    Hi all,

    My book, The Trail of Ted Bundy: Digging Up the Untold Stories, is available for pre-order for just $2.99 for the Kindle edition. This is a pre-order price only, and is due to go up after release.

    It will also be published soon in trade paper and in audio.

    Here’s a link to the Kindle:


    I know the book will soon spark many a conversation here on ET!

  22. Jason Nelson says:

    Thanks Kevin.

    Any idea when it will be available in the UK? Nice rare pic of Bundy on the cover BtW


    1. Kevin M Sullivan says:

      Hi Jason,

      Yes, that is a rare photo of Bundy. Indeed, I planned to use it in The Bundy Murders, but for some reason I left it out. But I contacted the Salt Lake Tribune to see if the release to use the photo is still good, and they said yes. So it’s front cover for the new book.

      I’m sure the Kindle version will be released in the UK the same time, or about the same time it’s released here in the U.S.; with the trade paper and audio editions soon to follow.

      Let me know what you think of it when you’re finished. And If you could also leave a review on Amazon, that would be great!


  23. Kevin M Sullivan says:

    Hello all!

    My new book about Ted Bundy is now available for pre-order:

  24. Steve says:

    I:just saw a video on Vimeo. I can’t link anything. So I will just give you the name of it and you can google it.

    “John Wilson remembers the execution of Ted Bundy.”

    It’s a short video. But it’s interesting to see someone years later describe what they saw.

    (Direct hyperlink added by the Headsman -ed.)

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Thanks Steve.

  25. Arnar Þór Þórsson says:

    Hi all. My “obsession” with Ted Bundy has resurfaced, maybe because of the discussion of a new book from you Kevin. I will surely order it as soon as possible. I was very happy when you sent me an autograph that i put in your first book. I am very much a lurker on this blog and rarely comment but i just wanted to say hi :)

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hi Arnar,

      It’s good to hear from you again! I hope things have been well with you and yours.

      The new book will be coming out on March 15th, and that’s right around the corner, as they say. I believe you and everyone who reads it will love it as it contains a lot of new info from folks you probably haven’t heard from before. I was both pleased and surprised when I received their stories!


  26. Sandy says:

    Mr. Sullivan,

    I’ve read your book and I loved it! Thanks for writing it. I have a question, please. I know Bundy had an icepick in his car when he was pulled over that fateful night. As far as you know, did he use the icepick on any of his victims? I am asking because it was one of the items he carried in his “kit,” but also because the picture on the cover of your book is an icepick! Yet I cannot recall ever reading of an injury to any victim that would have been caused by an icepick.

    Thank you,


    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hi Sandy…

      Well, this is weird: I posted a reply to you a couple of hours ago from my IPhone, and it’s not here. After i posted it, it showed it being there, but not now. Oh well lol!

      Anyway, thank you so much for the good comments about my book! I very much appreciate them!

      Bundy did puncture one of his victims in the abdomen with his ice pick. Now, the girl was no doubt already dead, so this must have been done to satisfy one of Bundy’s secret desires. The guy was always doing strange things to the dead bodies.

      As to the cover of my book, McFarland, the publisher didn’t consult me in the matter. Most publishers do not ask the writer about design features per the front and back covers, or internal design. The writer is responsible for the manuscript and the picture captions, but that’s about it.

      Of the four publishers I have, three asked for my feedback of the covers they were thinking of using on my upcoming publications. Now, I happened to like what they were doing and said so. However, I’m sure I didn’t have the final “say” in the matter, but at least they asked. But my Bundy book publisher did not. Personally, I haven’t had a problem with it, but it’s not what I would have done if it was my call. And I’m sure Bundy NEVER used the ice pick as a weapon.

      And say, Sandy, since you enjoyed the book so much, could you possibility write a review for it on Amazon, or wherever you received it? If you read it from the library or borrowed a copy, you can still leave a review at Amazon. Anyway, all reviews help, so thanks in advance for the review if you decide to write it. :)

      1. Sandy says:

        I am not a writer, but if you give me a couple of days to come up with it, then of course I will write a review! As I said, I loved the book and I seem to remember that you have a new one coming out this month, is that correct?


        1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

          Hi Sandy,

          Thanks for considering writing the review! And as to the review, it doesn’t have to be a long one. One, two or three sentences should be enough. Since you loved the book, just say so and anything that comes to mind about what you liked about it. And thanks!

          Yes, I have a new Bundy book coming out later this month. It’s a companion volume to the first book, and has many stories from people who knew Bundy and the victims, and most if not all of these have never before been in print; plus lots of other things make up the book as well. Lots of back stories, lol! I think you’ll really enjoy it. :)

        2. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

          Hi Sandy,

          Say, are you Sandra M who left the really nice review on Amazon? If that’s you, Sandy, thanks so much!

          However, if it is you, you left a one star review which is the least you can give. And if you didn’t mean to do that, could you change it to whatever you think it deserves?
          Thanks so much!


          1. Sandy says:

            That’s me and no, I didn’t even see the stars. Of course I will change it.


          2. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

            Thanks for making the change, Sandy. It’s very much appreciated! :)

  27. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

    Hi all…

    Apparently, the audio edition of The Bundy Murders is on sale at Amazon for just $3.99. Follow the link:


    Also, my new Bundy book (the companion volume) is set to be released next month as well.

  28. Shelley says:

    Apparently bite marks as evidence are being increasingly questioned. A podcast. Of course, they mention the Bundy case.


  29. Steve says:

    I have always, like many, wondered about the true victim count.

    I do not believe it’s anywhere near as high as 100, like Bob Keppel likes to claim. But I wonder what someone like Bill Hagmaier thinks. Considering they did go over an actual number.

    I don’t think it’s actually the 30 that he went over with Bill. But I don’t think it’s a super high number either. He became distracted by the killing in 74. I would assume he would’ve became distracted much earlier if he were killing like that in years previous to ’74.

    I feel he killed sporadically. Starting, possibly in the late 60’s. Then the compulsions took over by ’74, and he became the full blow killer he was known to be.

    1. Hal says:

      Steve, I’d go along with all of that. I think it’s somewhere between 35-50 (a staggering amount as it is, every one an apocalypse for the family concerned). And until it became his ‘thing’ circa ’73-4, you can probably count his victims on your fingers, maybe even on one hand. And I’d agree that the best professional guess would come from Hagmaier.

      Even if he killed Ann Burr at 14 as many believe, his final count could still be under 40. Remember Dahmer killed someone at 15, then was dormant till a similar age to Bundy when his ‘run’ began.

      As for the Burr killing… let me throw out a piece of circumstantial evidence that puts me in the ‘he did it’ camp. That Bundy mugshot during the original investigation (white T shirt) shows a young man with a ridiculous amount of wrinkles. I believe this is down to his obsession and possible sleep deprivation over years. It’s very unusual for someone in their twenties… but mid-teens?

      Check out that high school yearbook shot, Bundy in semi-profile sitting at a desk. Look at his forehead. This is a teenager already submerged in murderous fantasy, I reckon. It hardly proves he killed someone, obviously, but for me is a puzzle piece which indicated his obsession was already in place at the time of the Burr disappearance. And with that, I’m inclined to think he did it. And if he did, I think a handful of others might lie between Burr and Healy.

      1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

        Interesting post, Hal. Thanks.

      2. Bob Roberts says:

        Hi Hal,

        Which Bundy mugshot are you referring to (please link)?

        Incidentally I have had insomnia for years. No wrinkles though.


        1. Steve says:

          50 and below is fully reasonable. I’m in the “He didn’t do it” camp, on the Burr murder.

          He was capable of committing murder at 14. Many have done it earlier than that. But would he really have the intelligence to know where to put the body, so that it couldn’t be found?

          I do not think so. Remember Ted wasn’t anywhere near as smart as he has been made out to be.

          Wrinkles mean little at that age. Remember, Ted changed his look a billion times.

          They were always there.

          Just went back and looked at his high school yearbook pic. They’re missing there.

          I’m sure he had violent sexual fantasies from the time he hit puberty. But I really doubt they caused him much stress at that age.

    2. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hey Steve,

      Yes, I too don’t believe the higher numbers (100 in my view is absurd). But 40 plus victims? Yes, it’s quite possible.

      1. Steve says:

        O, I agree. I just think the high numbers are about as possible as Ottis Toole and Henry Lee Lucas. And we all know they lied. Ted killed more than them. Yet never approached a mind boggling number.

  30. Bob Roberts says:

    Hi all, Happy New Year and all the best for 2016. Thanks for another year of Bundy facts and speculation. Look forward to your new book Kevin. I’m about to re-read your book again. Regards, Bob.

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Hi Bob, and a Happy New Year to you!

      Tentative publication date for the new Bundy book is around late February or perhaps March. I’ll let everyone know more as we draw closer to it.

      And enjoy that second read of The Bundy Murders!

      1. Bob Roberts says:

        I may even write a review this time (a few years late I know).

        1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

          Yes, Bob, please do write a review, as every good review helps!



  31. morph says:

    thanks, kevin, for your thoughts.

    so, having weighed up all the above then I think we can see how the mall incident really played out.

    Bundy wanted a child that day.

    1. He only used the “authority figure” ruse with children.

    2. The “substation” story is only workable with children in mind … adults would be super-suspicious of that (even daRonch was)

    3. He had already researched the school he would visit afterwards.

    4. Ted’s outdoor strategy with adults was always back to his car asap. He had not planned for adults that day and so the DaRonch thing was a frustrated improv. And Ted makes mistakes when he is frustrated (Chi Omega, 2nd Lake Sam visit, etc).

    5. (This is total speculation) His strange return to the school play after already getting Debra Kent was because he really wanted a child.

    1. Kevin M. Sullivan says:

      Actually, morph, I don’t think he wanted a child that night. I think he wanted a young woman when he went to the mall.
      And, I think his police cover was designed to work with young females and it worked with DaRonch. Indeed, he was still playing cop at Viewmont High, and I did not find anything in the record that when Bundy asked the teacher to come out “and identify a car” for him, that she suspected he wasn’t a police officer. In other words, it wasn’t an issue. So Bundy could use that cop ruse on anyone; although, to my knowledge, he used it very sparingly. It wasn’t his regular MO, but he did use it.

      Also, I don’t consider Debra Kent a “child”, but she was younger than Carol DaRonch. Real children that Bundy killed would be Lynette Culver and Kim Leach. There were other children, of course, but we don’t know their names.

    2. M says:

      Perhaps he spoke to some people a certain way as he,Ted thought that was the way that person was supposed to be spoken to.Before approaching people I suppose he observed their actions and body movements so he could calculate the best way to approach them.I’m sure sometimes their reactions to him caught him off guard and he quickly had to think on his feet which usually did not always work when that would happen.As for the younger of the victims,he might have wanted a virgin.

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