1989: Ted Bundy, psycho killer

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It was 20 years today that Ted Bundy, the signature sexual psychopath in a golden age of serial killers,* rode the lightning in Florida’s Starke Prison.

Executed Today is pleased to mark the occasion with a conversation with Louisville crime writer Kevin M. Sullivan, author of a forthcoming2009 book on Ted Bundy … and a man who knows how the world looks from inside Bundy’s ski mask.

Ted Bundy is obviously one of the most iconic, written-about serial killers in history. Why a book about Ted Bundy? What’s the untold story that you set out to uncover?

The desire, or drive, if you will, to write an article about Ted Bundy and then create a 120,000 plus word book about the murders, was born out of my crossing paths with his infamous murder kit. Had Jerry Thompson [a key detective on the Bundy case -ed.] left Bundy’s stuff in Utah that May of 2005, well, it would have been an enjoyable meeting with the former detective, but I’m certain it would have all ended quietly there. Indeed, I doubt if I’d even considered writing an article for Snitch [a now-defunct crime magazine -ed.], much less a book about the killings. But it was having all that stuff in my hands, and in my home, and then being given one of the Glad bags from Ted’s VW that made it very real (or surreal) to me, and from this, a hunger to find out more about the crimes led me forward.


Ted Bundy’s gear, right where you want it — image courtesy of Kevin M. Sullivan. (Check the 1975 police photo for confirmation.)

Believe me, in a thousand years, I never would have expected such a thing to ever come my way. I can’t think of anything more odd or surreal.

ET: You mentioned that you think you’ve been able to answer some longstanding questions about Bundy’s career. Can you give us some hints? What don’t people know about Ted Bundy that they ought to know?

I must admit, when I first decided to write a book about the crimes, I wasn’t sure what I’d find, so the first thing I had to do was read every book ever written about Bundy, which took the better portion of three or four months.

From this I took a trip to Utah to again meet with Thompson and check out the sites pertaining to Bundy and the murders in that state. Next came the acquisition of case files from the various states and the tracking down of those detectives who participated in the hunt for the elusive killer.

Now, no one could have been more surprised than me to begin discovering what I was discovering about some of these murders. But as I kept hunting down the right people and the right documents, I was able to confirm these “finds” at every turn. And while I cannot reveal everything here, It’s all in the book in great detail. Indeed, you could say that my book is not a biography in the truest sense, but rather an in-depth look at Bundy and the murders from a vantage point that is quite unique. I wish I could delve further into these things now , but I must wait until it’s published.

The Bundy story has a magnetic villain and a host of victims … was there a hero? Was there a lesson?

The real heroes in this story are the detectives who worked day and night for years to bring Ted Bundy to justice. And if there’s a lesson to be learned from all of this, it is this: It doesn’t matter how handsome or articulate a person might be, or how nicely they smile at you, for behind it all, there could reside the most diabolical person you’ll ever meet! We need to remember this.

But how can you act on that lesson without living in a continual state of terror? Bundy strikes me as so far outside our normal experience, even the normal experience of criminality, that I’m inclined to wonder how much can be generalized from him.

Actually, (and I might say, thank God here!) people as “successful” as Ted Bundy don’t come our way very often. I mean, the guy was a rising star in the Republican Party in Washington, had influential friends, a law student, and certainly appeared to be going places in life. Some were even quite envious of his ascension in life. However, it was all a well-placed mask that he wore to cover his true feelings and intentions. On the outside he was perfect, but on the inside a monster. He just didn’t fit the mold we’re used to when we think of a terrible killer, does he?

Now, there are those among us — sociopaths — who can kill or do all manner of terrible things in life and maintain the nicest smile upon their faces, but again, just beneath the surface ticks the heart of a monster, or predator, or what ever you might want to call them. Having said that, I’m not a suspicious person by nature, and so I personally judge people by their outward appearance until shown otherwise. Still, it’s difficult (if not impossible) to see the “real” individual behind the person they present to us on a daily basis.

You worked with case detectives in researching your book. How did the Ted Bundy case affect the way law enforcement has subsequently investigated serial killers? If they had it to do over again, what’s the thing you think they’d have done differently?

They all agree that today, DNA would play a part of the investigation that wasn’t available then. However, in the early portion of the murders, Bundy made few if any mistakes, as he had done his homework so as to avoid detection. As such, even this wouldn’t be a panacea when it came to a very mobile killer like Bundy who understood the very real limitations sometimes surrounding homicide investigations.

I can’t help but ask about these detectives as human beings, too. Clearly they’re in a position to deal with the heart of darkness in the human soul day in and day out and still lead normal lives … is a Ted Bundy the kind of killer that haunts or scars investigators years later, or is this something most can set aside as all in a day’s work?

They are, first of all, very nice people. And you can’t be around them (either in person, or through numerous phone calls or emails) for very long before you understand how dedicated they are (or were) in their careers as police officers. They are honorable people, with a clear sense of duty, and without such people, we, as a society, would be in dire circumstances indeed.

Even before Bundy came along, these men were veteran investigators who had seen many bad things in life, so they carried a toughness which allowed them to deal with the situations they came up against in a professional manner. That said, I remember Jerry Thompson telling me how he looked at Ted one day and thought how much he reminded him of a monster, or a vampire of sorts. And my book contains a number of exchanges between the two men (including a chilling telephone call) which demonstrate why he felt this way

How about for you, as a writer — was there a frightening, creepy, traumatic moment in your research that really shook you? Was there an emotional toll for you?

Absolutely. But the degree of “shock”, if you will, depends (at least for me) on what I know as I first delve into each murder. In the Bundy cases I had a general knowledge of how Bundy killed, so there wasn’t a great deal that caught me by surprise, as it were. Even so, as a writer, you tend to get to know the victims very well through the case files, their family members or friends, and so on. Hence, I’ll continue to carry with me many of the details of their lives and deaths for the remainder of my life. And so, lasting changes are a part of what we do.

However, I did a story a few years back about a 16 year old girl who was horribly murdered here in Kentucky, and this case did cause me to wake up in the night in a cold sweat. Perhaps it was because I have a daughter that was, at the time, only a few years younger than this girl, and that some of what transpired did catch me off guard, so to speak, as I began uncovering just what had happened to this very nice kid.

Watch for Kevin M. Sullivan’s forthcoming The Bundy Murders: A Comprehensive History from McFarland in summer or fall of 2009.

* In fact, the term “serial killer” was coined in the 1970’s by FBI profiler Robert Ressler, as an improvement on the sometimes inaccurate category of “stranger killer”.

Additional Bundy resources from the enormous comment thread:

On this day..

Possibly related executions:

8,544 thoughts on “1989: Ted Bundy, psycho killer”

  1. Thanks, George. I’d never given a lot of thought about it after Bob told me that, but I found it interesting that he had possession of everything that was in Ted’s cell. As that part of his life was of no real concern to me (as far as writing the book) I didn’t follow up on it, or ask any questions as to “why” it went down like that. Now that I know that others were perhaps staking claims, it seems a bit of a power-play was involved, and on a personal level, I find that interesting indeed. Thanks.

  2. Hey guys-
    Regarding the Bundy material – it is my understanding,based on a Florida newspaper article I came across,that Ted intended for his “estate” as it were,to go to Diana.She was,for example,custodian of his remains.But he wanted her to have everything else too,especially his papers.In the end ,the courts forced Ms.Weiner to relinquish everything to Keppel,given their possible relevance to the “unsolved” homicides.

  3. It could be that Bundy instructed the prison to turn everything over to Keppel, I just don’t know. And I hope, (although I don’t know what Keppel’s plans are in this matter) he turns everything over to the King County Archives at some point in the future. The King Co. Archives is a massive repository for the Bundy case, and I personally couldn’t think of a better home for that stuff to go to. But who knows?

  4. Yeah, I meant Ronald Holmes.

    This looks like great stuff. OK, I can’t wait to read this baby.

    I guess by the time of Ted’s death, Carol Boone didn’t want anything to do with him and Diane Weiner’s relationship with Ted as his personal attorney had dissolved due to his death. You’d think they’d send Ted’s stuff to his mother. I imagine the Warden had it out for Ted after the 3 stays & it gave him great plaeasure to give the stuff to Keppel.

    From a historical perspective, Bob was the right guy to get that material.

  5. Idaho was informed only days prior to Bundy’s execution that he had some Idaho victims he wanted to talk about. Upon hearing this, folks from the state visited Bundy and listened to his revelations of murder; revelations of things that he knew only they would know, and the investigators quickly understood he was telling the truth. So all of this occurred almost at the last moment. During my research I was able to locate various documents heretofore rarely seen by the public, as well as locating the two investigators who interviewed Ted. From my interviews with these two men, readers will learn some things about Bundy that they probably never knew prior to reading my book.

    Ron Holmes first interviewed Bundy (I believe) in 1986 or 1987. I know the Tacoma News Tribune ran an article about it in 1987, and I include information about this in my book. Also, Holmes received many letters from Bundy (copies of which I’ve seen, as my friend who worked with Holmes has copies of them) and the two apparently had quite a correspondence going for some time. Also, I remember Bob Keppel telling me that after Bundy’s execution, the prison gave him everything belonging to Ted, ad as such, he’s read all these letters. Just another interesting point in the story of the Bundy murders!

  6. Confession material from Idaho?

    The police interviews prior to DaRonch, er what, Kevin?

    Also when did the Robert holmes confessions take place? You’ve stated some of it was in the Tacoma papers. Have they published it all at theis point?

  7. No problem, Claudia. And be sure to let me know what you think after reading it, will you?

    Take care,

    Kevin

  8. You sure piqued my interest, too, Kevin! Thanks for responding. I look forward to reading.

  9. Hi KYGB–

    Well, Bundy was “on a roll” as it were, prior to Lake Sammamish, and I believe he felt invincible. Anyway, just a little tidbit of his personality (as I see it) from the book.

    They never found the skull of Hawkins, and according to what Bob Keppel stated in his book, the landscape had changed quite a bit in the 15 years between her killing and Ted’s confession. So, with new trees popping up, and erosion occurring in places, etc, that’s understandable.

    I was able to make use of the confession material; almost all of which, I believe, is truthful info given by Bundy in an attempt to save his hide from the electric chair, or at least save himself for awhile. As I posted earlier at this site, I was able to obtain the confession material from Idaho, and it is quite revealing. And perhaps many readers will be seeing it for the first time. I have also received confession material from the lead investigators that was never on tape, and that was once on tape but now may be lost forever. Of course, nothing is usually lost forever!

    See ya,

    Kevin

  10. Kevin , yeah that’s big a point. You have accomplished your intent.

    Curious as to what you (an/or the investigators) got out of Ted’s last confessions during the execution week. He made one in which he indicated the location of Hawkin’s skull.

    Did this material pan out into discoveries?

    Also, were you able to make use of the confession material?

  12. “He was attempting to make a point” – you’ve sure piqued my interest.

  13. Gee, Claudia, I didn’t stop to think about the date (in connection with Lake Sam, that is) until you mentioned it. I’m usually really good about those things, so thanks for reminding me. You know, I feel like I kinda know these ladies(and all of Ted’s victims); that is, many of them were born in the same year, or close to the same year that I was born, so we must have shared some of the same types of experience, at a time in history that was rather tumultuous, what with the war and drugs, and what not. And then, in writing the book, I learned many things about them, and in a case or two, spoke to their friends, and just generally got to “know them”.

    But to get back on track, I’ll answer your question concerning those at the lake that day: The only person I interviewed that I know has a connection to Lake Sam is Bob Keppel, who, of course, was involved in the investigation, but he wasn’t at the lake that day. Now, it’s possible I spoke to someone else in my research who was at the lake that day, but because I was asking them about another aspect of the case, the subject would not necessarily come up. However, the testimony of the witnesses who were interviewed by the police is substantial, and I drew from this record constantly as I wrote about the abductions there. The official record, obtained from the public soon after a crime is committed is always better than asking John Q citizen about it 35 years later. Of course, you can speak with any of the lead detectives who worked the Bundy case, and it’s practically as fresh as when they worked it! Anyway, I’ll move on.

    I also discuss Bundy using his real name there, the possible motivations for doing so, and how costly that decision would ultimately be for him in the near future. I also delve into why (as I see it) Bundy chose to do a double abduction that day. It was very strange, but he was attempting to make a point, and you’ll read more about this in the book.

    Take care,

    Kevin

  14. Hard to believe it’s been 35 years to the day since Lake Sam. Kevin, I was wondering whether you had the opportunity to speak with any of the surviving Lake Sam witnesses in connection with your research? That day seems to have been such an odd scenario, given the extraordinary risks that Bundy took. It was long before his Florida unraveling, and it’s hard to believe he would approach so many women and use his real name. I wonder if Liz Kendall’s and Ann Rule’s suspicions would have been aroused so promptly if Bundy had simply introduced himself to potential victims with a fake name. It seems to me that he had periods in which he lacked his usual self-control.

  15. Hi Jason,

    Well, concerning the Idaho excursion, Bundy admitted to attempting to abduct other women the day prior to snatching the Culver girl, but when pressed by authorities, he said he doubted if these women ever became suspicious of him, so (as I say in the book) they must have ended in the early stages. So the scale (if we had one!) could run from women feeling no fear about contact with him, to those who believed he was strange or weird, to those who felt outright fear he might attack and kill them. Most of these, however, we’ll never hear about.

    And yes, a publication date of September always did sound more realistic to me, because that would mean it was published 9 months after they received the manuscript. And again, that’s fast in the publishing world.

  16. Hi everyone.
    Kevin, do you comment on attempted abductions made by Bundy which were unsuccessful in your book that are not widely known? As you mentioned above, there must of been a huge number of girls and women who stumbled across Bundy’s path and i would of imagined that a few had reported what happened to them. Bundy mentioned to Dr Lewis in Polly Nelsons book that he had once booked into a hotel room somewhere ( I cant recall the town/city offhand), and whilst under some form of disguise, he would go prowling for some girls. Maybe it was because he was unsuccessful at this time that he decided to stop hunting until a couple of years later, but i believe he may have done this a couple of times.
    I recieved an email about two days ago stating the delivery estimates for your book. It stated it may start to be shipped between September 29 2009 – October 22 2009. I believe this is more of an accurate prediction.

  17. One correction: Bundy wasn’t so “weird” in Pocatello, but he did have things working against him. In Florida, however, he was extremely weird, and was but a mere shadow of what he once was (the planning of his crimes, etc) when he was abducting females in Washington State. Indeed, I delve deeply into this aspect of his personality for the book.

  18. You’re correct, Fiz. It does get old with people (and it’s more common than one might think) trying to connect themselves to the story of Ted Bundy. Having said that, I ‘ll give but two of many examples that I touch upon in the book: First, in Idaho, he approached many women that escaped his grasp, and I give the reasons why. I also explain why they probably never felt threatened by him, even though he was trying to lure them to their deaths. Also, before he killed the Leach girl, he spent the day prior to this hunting in Jacksonville, Florida, but was unsuccessful, and who knows how many women and young girls he approached on that day. That he spent the entire day searching for a victim is without question, but like Pocatello, Idaho, he came up empty. So how many women in these two cities were approached by a (by this time) weird guy? Who can say with any certainty, but I would think the number has to be in the dozens. And that’s just two days out of his fairly long career of murder.

  19. I wonder just how many women he came across – other girls spoke at the time of being approached by him at Lake Sammamish and one girl got away from him on a campus by kicking his so-called “missing keys” at him. However I also know that people want to have been “escaped victims”, like the one here who was determined to argue against known facts, just to try and “prove” she was one.Ann Rule gets them regularly on her Guest Book. Sheesh!

  20. Hi Virginia–

    First, thanks for the kind words about the book.

    Now, the Healy abduction could have gone down two different ways: True, he may have struck her, and carried her out unconscious into the night, but he may also have choked her until she passed out. He would later speak of this with Michaud & Aynesworth, saying this is what caused the hemorrhage of blood found on the bed, and this is quite possible. And if he is telling the truth here, without question, she awakened to see the face of her abductor; unless, of course, he struck her in the car. This is another area where we may never know exactly what happened, but I personally think he probably choked her that night, and later killed her by strangling her and by a blow or blows to the head. As far as the book goes (and it’s been a long time since I’ve read that portion) I describe the attack and touch upon the possibilities therein.

    I did not see the NBC special, so I can’t speak about the person you remember seeing on the program. However, it certainly sounds like Bundy. And of course, Bundy approached many women during those years, so there are scores of females who came very close to the killer and never knew it.

    Thanks for the questions.

    Kevin

  21. Kevin–Hello there, I’m excited about the new book. I have two comments/questions. . .you may refer to them in the book, but I’d appreciate a brief response if possible.

    1) Regarding the previous mention of Lynda Ann Healy–I’ve never believed she woke up after Bundy knocked her out. Joni Lenz was in a coma, and we can imagine what Lynda received was comparable. I’ve always believed his third-person references to this murder were simply to make it seem more rape-motivated than murder-motivated. We all know Bundy did not need a conscious victim. Does your book speculate about any of this?

    2) Years ago I saw a Bundy special on a major network, possibly NBC, that interviewed a woman who claimed Bundy approached her in 1974 or 75. We all know there are hundreds of such claims, but hers seemed quite legitimate, in part because (I believe) she had filed a police report. She also at the time completely fit his victim profile, age 17 or so and looked quite a bit like Melissa Smith. I remember she said Bundy pulled up beside her in his VW as she walked down the sidewalk, stopped, pulled out a map, and asked her for directions. She didn’t feel entirely comfortable, so she didn’t offer much help. Then he asked her if she wouldn’t mind getting in the car and directing him. She said no and quickly walked toward her home. Her drove away but was in the vicinity of her house before she even approached it, asking her once again for help. She believed her had previously watched her and knew where she lived. Does this sound familiar to you? I wondered if you had run across this story.

  22. Hey KYBG–

    Yeah, isn’t that one Bundy admitted to, and then immediately started backtracking? If memory serves me correctly, I think that’s the one. And yes, I believe Ted did kill someone at that time, but I didn’t come across anything in my research that would give me a possible name, and frankly, I was so busy taking care of biz in other areas, I didn’t actively pursue it. But yes, his backing off tells me he’s no doubt guilty of the deed.

  23. Hi Claire–

    Someone mentioned the Smith girl a while back, and I don’t think she’s a Bundy victim as she disappeared (I believe) just as Ted was returning to Utah from an extended stay in WA. I think the cops were watching him closely, and I believe he knew this. But that just goes to show that other killers were out there even when Bundy was roaming around, and sadly, the same is true for today.

    And no, I’m not yet on face book. Fiz has been wanting me to jump on board, and I will, but I’m moving like a turtle in that direction and I’m just not there yet, LOL!

  24. Headsman- Was that Cyber outtage was part of the coordinated attack on key sites that was discussed in the media? if so, you are in select company on here, eh?

    Kevin, I have this one in one of my victim lists:

    1973
    • May 1973: Unknown hitchhiker, Tumwater, Washington area. Confessed to Bob Keppel before Bundy’s execution. No remains found.

    Do you think it’s legit, or what did you find on this one?

    “The Unpleasant Lurker”

  26. We all know the accurate victim list is incomplete. I think even law agencies know that. 100 is impossible. If Ted was 60 which he would have passed by now, if alive, and was caught today that 100 figure could be very likely.

    On some lists it has Debbie Smith in feb 1976 in Salt Lake City. I find this highly unlikely as Ted would have been preparing for the DaRonch case. Do you know if Debbie Smith is confirmed victim Kevin?

  27. Hi George, Headsman (no prob about the outage) and everyone!

    Yes, the Healy abduction, perhaps the strangest of them all. Here we have a young woman going to bed in a house filled with other people. She closed her eyes on an otherwise normal night, and awakened to find herself in the hands of an abductor. And not only does a very unlikely abduction take place, but he makes the bed, grabs some clothes and a book bag, and carries her out and up the back steps into a college kid-filled nocturnal neighborhood where anyone could have seen them. It is exceedingly bizarre, unlikely, and perhaps will never be carried out by any other abductor in the same way again. The Healy kidnapping-murder is the strangest I’ve ever come across, and does not appear like Bundy was doing this for the first time. The entire situation screams of an expertise not found in a first-time abductor. Yet, because we cannot prove otherwise, it must (as far as my book is concerned) be seen as the first in Bundy’s career of murder.

    The Idaho investigator told me one day that he suspected that Bundy (he first heard about him when Ted was charged in the DaRonch case in Utah) might be involved, but that his (Bundy’s)
    attorneys kept throwing up obstacles to an interview.

    As I’ve said here before, I believe Bundy is responsible for more victims than we know about, and this aspect of the case will no doubt remain a mystery for all time.

  28. Sorry about the long outage Friday-Saturday, everyone. Happened at hosting level and took out a lot of other sites as well … hopefully life is better now.

  29. Hey guys,
    I know it is foolish as a reseacher to engage in much speculation-but this case has seemed to beg for it from the start.Consider the Healy case.The attack,the methods used in covering up the attack,the site of the attack itself,speak to a self assured ,confident assailant.Not his first time at the rodeo,as it were.Yet for a long while this was considered the first of the series,excepting Joni Lenz.
    If one recalls the M+A tapes,we are supposed to believe that Ted went from a few drunken ,fumbling assualts to a series of near perfect abductions with nary a step in between.Ted is screwing with chronology here.I believe he did that consistently and left many gaps he hoped he could get back to.
    Remember the confessions.Bundy constantly bemoaned the lack of time.Had there been a stay,I have no doubt there would have been revelations afresh.As a prosecutor predicted in the Larsen book,right before each prospective execution date there would have been one more.He would have been around awhile.
    A good example is Idaho. Law Enforcement IN IDAHO were not aware Bundy would want to speak to them.I think this was a precursor to other revelations planned to be given at other times.Ted was an adept serial murderer and a traveler.He did not learn his trade all of a sudden.So,that being said,N.M is a definite possibility in my opinion.He would have enjoyed the skiing over there.Who knows,maybe he did.

  30. I never checked NM. Indeed, NM is one state that never entered my mind. However, if Bundy is in fact a killer (sporadically) from the 1960’s, his reach could have extended farther than one might think. Still, we must be careful in assuming anything, as we’re in the realm of speculation, and everyone knows how I feel about that, LOL!

  31. When you were checking missing persons reports, did you check New Mexico? Bundy killed in Aspen and Vail, two of the three upscale ski resorts in the area at the time. I would think Taos would hold the same appeal for him.

  32. Hi Gray, and welcome to our on going conversation about the madman, Theodore Robert Bundy–

    Well, Gray, you certainly were in the mix of things back then, I must say!

    And yes, I do believe it’s a very real possibility he killed little Ann Marie Burr. I understand that many “out there” today think this just isn’t so, but Theodore all but admitted killing her to Dr. Ronald Holmes in 1987. Now, I can’t be dogmatic about it, and say he did the deed for sure. But I will, for the remainder of my life, lean towards the fact that most likely he did.

    As to other murders prior to 1974, yes, I am certain of it. But beyond mentioning this, I stay clear of it in the book, choosing instead to concentrate on his known murders. And besides, 1974 was a real turning point in Bundy’s life, as he was saying goodbye forever to his old life of apparent normalcy, to one of unrestricted and unabated murder. There would be no return from here, and even Bundy knew it.

    And thanks for ordering the book, Gray. I really do think you’ll love it.

    Take care,

    Kevin

  33. Hi Everyone! It’s good to be back in my chair in front of my PC!

    Okay. First to the total number of victims of Ted Bundy: This is something we will never know for sure, as that information, went with Bundy to the grave. One figure tossed about is 36 victims, and that does not seem unreasonable. 100 or above, in my opinion, is way out there, and I personally don’t believe Ted could have pulled that number off. Perhaps the number is 50, or close to it. Maybe it’s only 30, but even here, that’s a large number of people to kill and dispose of without getting caught in the act, as it were.

    I will say this, however, that in writing this book, I made it a point of obtaining missing persons reports from surrounding states where it was assumed Bundy didn’t operate, as well as from the states from which he killed (and these would be having to do with women he was not suspected of abducting and killing). And believe me, in the dozens and dozens of police reports I poured over, there would pop out occasionally a report of a missing young girl, or young woman, that had Bundy’s MO all over it. In some cases I am absolutely convinced it was him, but because this is my own speculation, it was left out of the book. So I have to admit, I do believe Ted killed more (perhaps far more) than he admitted to at the end, but the actual number, for me, if I had to “guess’ would be 36 plus.

  34. Before I make the point I want to make, I’d just like to briefly present myself as an example of “Bundy synchronicity” which is very common in Washington. When I moved to Seattle in January of 1974 I spent a lot of time at a friend’s who lived within a block of Freda Rogers’ rooming house. A few months later in 1974 my stewardess fiancee and I moved to a house near the Flame Tavern in Burien, site of the Brenda Ball abduction. On July 14th 1974, I was playing touch football at Lake Sammammish, near the abduction site of Denise Naslund and Janice Ott. Later I moved to Tacoma (around 1981) and bought a house 3 blocks from the Burr home. Hence my interest in Bundy, and why I read all the books and eagerly await yours, Kevin. One more anecdote: Some time in the late 80’s when Bundy was on death row I was at a party and the subject of his case came up. Unbeknownst to me there was a lady there who was a friend of the Bundy family, and who was outraged that I didn’t understand there were no tapes (e.g. Michaud & Aisworth), that the books were scams, and that Bundy was “as normal as you are.”
    Here’s my opinion, just an opinion: I think that Bundy’s “career” began with Ann Marie Burr, because this gave him the confidence, the belief and the committmemt that he could enter houses and abduct women. He may have gone into a long latency, but he KNEW he could practice that MO and get away with it. I think the idea that he could begin in January 1974 with Lynda Healy after being jilted by a girlfriend and could suddenly start to practice such an elaborate and diverse “career” is naive, no offense to the writers who maintain that. Kevin, I very much look forward to your book which I’ve ordered from Amazon.

    Gray

  35. Hey-
    You know,there seems to be a division of opinion in the literature.You have the traditional list,that starts with Healy and ends with Leach.Thats 30-36.But the problem is ,what if it started long before that ?You dont even have to go all the way back to Burr.Theres the stewardesses in 66,cases in Vermont,California,etc,all possibilities.My personal opinion:Ted killed more than he took credit for,maybe many more,but 100 seems too high

  36. You know KYGB I was about to ask him the same thing! All of the materail I’ve read seems to put it up in the 100 mark as well. I would like to venture out and say I don’t think Gary Ridgeway had anything on Ted Bundy? Can’t wait to see what Kevin thinks!

  37. Kevin, wondered what your take was on the total number of Ted’s victims. Some of the books kick around totals as high as 100. Bundy himself poo-poo’ed that to Polly Nelson, saying the media “wouldn’t quote that figure if they knew how hard it was to do even one murder”.

    30 of the killings seem like a figure that can be verified, but much of the literature puts the total at 35.

    What do you feel is the grand total?

  38. Hey everyone!

    I’ll be off line until tomorrow night. Keep the questions and comments coming, and I’ll see you then.

    Kevin

  39. Good question, George…

    Yeah, I was a little surprised at how Bundy taunted Jerry Thompson, the Utah investigator. And in that regard, I was very surprised that he threw in Jerry’s face (and made it a source of humor, even), one of the girls he’d killed, during a telephone call between the two of them. This type of conduct was not wise from a legal perspective, and did nothing to deter Thompson from his relentless hounding of Bundy. It wasn’t a smart thing to do, but then, when it came to dealing with the police, Bundy wasn’t brightest light on the block.

    Another aspect of the case that everyone here might enjoy hearing about came in the form of some very good citizens of Washington State and beyond, who, for one reason or another, honestly believed they’d spotted one of the missing girls who ultimately became confirmed Bundy victims. I literally have dozens of police reports stating so-in-so saw this missing girl or that missing girl hitchhiking, or boarding a boat, or eating at a mom & pop joint many miles from the scene of where she disappeared. All well-meaning people, mind you, but all dead wrong. But the point is this, the police hours that must go in to checking these “sightings” out, is very time-consuming and exceedingly costly. Not to mention, that many of these police departments were working overtime trying to find these women and the person or persons who snatched them. Just a little discovery through research that I found a bit interesting.

    And lastly, this was a “shocker” to me (I must FIRST say that I will never identify the state where this occurred, the individual, or the writer I’m about to mention. It’s not in the book, and I must be somewhat vague in discussing it here): Okay, there was a particular “officer” over a certain institution, who, when the girl disappeared, didn’t see any foul play involved. Fine. No problem with that. However, as time went by, and with absolutely no sign of the girl, one might begin to think foul play was involved. Not so here. After a time he was contacted by other investigators in other states, who spoke of the similarities between their missing girls and his missing person. This, however, did not deter him from believing that the girl simply walked away, and he still refused to believe foul play was involved; stating that until, he said, he saw otherwise, he wouldn’t believe it. Then, even the parents of the girl suggested she might have been abducted, but he still assured them there was no evidence for that conclusion, and that they shouldn’t worry. The closest he ever came to admitting that it might be “foul play” was in a brief mention in a letter to someone, but he quickly follows it up by saying there is no evidence to confirm this, and until there is, he wouldn’t accept it as being true. Now, in a particular book, the writer states that this person believed that the girl disappeared as a result of foul play, and believed it early on in the investigation, and this simply isn’t true. I know it isn’t true, because I have EVERY LETTER this man officially sent out during the investigation. So what’s up with the writer? Who knows? This I also found as a bit of an eye opener, one might say.

    Gee, my fingers are weary from typing, LOL!!

  40. hey guys-
    Kevin,I wanted to ask(and I know you cant be specific)if,given what you had already known about Bundy,if there was anything you uncovered suprised or shocked you.

  41. I certainly don’t mind waiting! I do object to Amazon’s email though, because their usual tactic is to wait several months and then tell me the book isn’t going to be published! I want another book, which is going to be published by Penguin in the UK, I’ve seen the cover, and read the paginated pages of the introduction and the first couple of pages, so I know it’s real. The author has told me it is due for publication in Jan. 2010. Does Amazon co.uk have a pre-order site available? Of course they don’t! Talk about short-sighted!

  42. Thanks Ted, for the very kind words! I really appreciate your interest in the book, and the time you’ve spent going over it. Thanks again!

    Kevin

  43. Everyone,

    You will love Kevin’s book, believe me. It’s incisive, intense and has information in it that none of the other books in the Bundy ouevre have. It is definitely worth the wait. I won’t be at all surprised if it shoots directly to the top of your list of the best books on Bundy.
    Enjoy!
    Ted

  44. Hi Claudia–

    One of the editors at McFarland contacted Amazon with new information as to when the book will be published. She said it will be a general release date without naming a specific day. However, they’re at the very last stage before generating the proofs, so it really won’t be much longer. They do a wonderful job at McFarland, and as I said in an earlier post, they publish lots of books.

    And thanks, Claudia, for the interest in my book. I really believe you’re gonna love it, as it has much new info on Ted’s trail of murder.

    Take care,

    Kevin

  45. Hi Everyone,

    Longtime lurker. Kevin, I am very much looking forward to reading your book, whatever the release date.

    I, too, received the email from Amazon asking me to reconfirm my interest in ordering the book. I have received similar e-mails from Amazon with regard to pre-ordered items, though, so I wouldn’t be too concerned. It’s just an automatic aspect of their customer service, so people don’t forget about items they’ve ordered and then get angry when they are later charged. I’ve always confirmed and never had a problem.

    I have to say, I think the canon of legitimate Bundy books out there is very good and diverse, if incomplete. I’m sure Kevin’s book will add something very exciting to the mix.

  47. Hi Fiz–

    Thanks for letting me know about this, as I will email the publishing house immediately. Perhaps they will contact Amazon UK, US, and Canada and let them know something. My editor conveyed to me recently (as I’ve put forth here) that the July 5th date was an estimate only. However, I’m waiting on the proofs and hopefully it won’t be much longer. But I am sorry the July 5th date through some folks off, and actually, if the book came out in September, it would mean that it was published only about 9 months after McFarland received it. And that, in the publishing world, would be quick indeed.

  48. Hi KYGB–

    I had contact with a couple different families, and some friends of the victims. To tell you the truth, I didn’t want to contact many of them, as I didn’t want to create a new wave of grief in their lives. Everything (well, almost everything) I would need was found in the official record, or the testimony of detectives and the like. Only in rare cases did I need the impute from those so close to the murders. And it matters not that it’s been 35 years since the murders began, the pain in the lives of the living is still very real, and in some cases, close to the surface.

    And yes, I can write books without encountering a single, unconquerable problem, but God help me while navigating my PC, LOL!!

  49. Kevin, I had an email today from Amazon.com asking me if I still wanted to buy your book as they didn’t have a definite date for it. I had to “sign in” to keep the order live. I do hope this won’t put off any potential buyers. I did not find it a helpful move from Amazon, I must say!

  50. Yeah Kevin, learn this cyber game, willya? (There, now that was sarcastic)

    Always wanted to ask a semi-serious question about the book. How much interation did you have with victim survivors. I’d think this would be a very ticklish area, but did you do any work in that area?

    Just askin’, pal.

    KYGB, an unpleasant lurker.

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